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Post by draftsman on Feb 6, 2014 18:15:34 GMT -8
Pretty much what happened to Shin Megami Tensei. Now instead of demons we have schoolar dramas...and a dancing game. I can bear with some of the sappy things in the latest Persona entries(even if they detract awfully from what made the series unique in the first place), but the dancing game was pushing it. Yet it is the advertised more. Rant aside, it does happen, and the rabbid games along with Persona are good examples of this happening. Persona isn't just a high school drama, you know. They do have stories. Even P4 (which is the one that bothers you the most, yes?) has a plot. People getting pulled into a different world through TVs and getting murdered, and a ragtag group bands together to stop it. Sure, it's main cast may be high school students, and some Social Link could count, but the main plot itself isn't a high school drama plot. I also don't really get the whole "Persona isn't as dark as SMT, therefor it's inferior" argument, but hey, that's for another thread. Highschool drams do have plots if sucky, you're doing that one thing MasterofFoxews did. Anyhow, the plots in Persona started to decay in 3 (the first one and 2 were still dark), and it just killed it in Persona 4. It fails most of the time when trying to pull out dark undertones(half of the shadows are issues not that hard to overcome, harsh or interesting overall), and it's presentation backfires on it's own premise("Reaching out the Truth" is just terribly upbeat for a game focused in mysterious murders). Plus, when you take out one of the main appeals of the series which was the denial of classical JRPG clichés in favor of different approaches to the genre, the lack of darkness is indeed a problem, because they go back to such overused to death clichés in the plot's structure. Instead of moral choices and being forced to kill partners, along with genuine moral ambiguity, we get date sim mechanics. Fucking date sim mechanics. But again, this is a Sonic thread, therefore we should reserve this for a SMT/Persona thread. |
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Post by SteaminFeline56 on Feb 6, 2014 18:35:56 GMT -8
Persona isn't just a high school drama, you know. They do have stories. Even P4 (which is the one that bothers you the most, yes?) has a plot. People getting pulled into a different world through TVs and getting murdered, and a ragtag group bands together to stop it. Sure, it's main cast may be high school students, and some Social Link could count, but the main plot itself isn't a high school drama plot. I also don't really get the whole "Persona isn't as dark as SMT, therefor it's inferior" argument, but hey, that's for another thread. Highschool drams do have plots if sucky, you're doing that one thing MasterofFoxews did. Anyhow, the plots in Persona started to decay in 3 (the first one and 2 were still dark), and it just killed it in Persona 4. It fails most of the time when trying to pull out dark undertones(half of the shadows are issues not that hard to overcome, harsh or interesting overall), and it's presentation backfires on it's own premise("Reaching out the Truth" is just terribly upbeat for a game focused in mysterious murders). Plus, when you take out one of the main appeals of the series which was the denial of classical JRPG clichés in favor of different approaches to the genre, the lack of darkness is indeed a problem, because they go back to such overused to death clichés in the plot's structure. Instead of moral choices and being forced to kill partners, along with genuine moral ambiguity, we get date sim mechanics. Fucking date sim mechanics. But again, this is a Sonic thread, therefore we should reserve this for a SMT/Persona thread. Also keep in mind that Rabbids were what sparked this conversation. |
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Post by PhantomHigh on Feb 6, 2014 19:53:26 GMT -8
I'm uneasy withKnuckle's redesign, but I can get by the other characters'
Though when I first saw Amy,I thought...well to put it mildly...I thought she became a call girl. Just...DAT dress.
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Post by Pandora on Feb 6, 2014 22:31:38 GMT -8
...I'm sorry, I still can't quite get behind the excessive bandages.
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Post by Malcolm Belmont on Feb 7, 2014 0:04:34 GMT -8
Highschool drams do have plots if sucky, you're doing that one thing MasterofFoxews did. Anyhow, the plots in Persona started to decay in 3 (the first one and 2 were still dark), and it just killed it in Persona 4. It fails most of the time when trying to pull out dark undertones(half of the shadows are issues not that hard to overcome, harsh or interesting overall), and it's presentation backfires on it's own premise("Reaching out the Truth" is just terribly upbeat for a game focused in mysterious murders). Plus, when you take out one of the main appeals of the series which was the denial of classical JRPG clichés in favor of different approaches to the genre, the lack of darkness is indeed a problem, because they go back to such overused to death clichés in the plot's structure. Instead of moral choices and being forced to kill partners, along with genuine moral ambiguity, we get date sim mechanics. Fucking date sim mechanics. But again, this is a Sonic thread, therefore we should reserve this for a SMT/Persona thread. Also keep in mind that Rabbids were what sparked this conversation. I still think Persona 4 is a good game. But i also think their delimas are more realistic.. Anyway i hope we see more footage of this game soon.. |
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Post by clownboss on Feb 7, 2014 2:22:31 GMT -8
News flash: A lot of people don't think Sonic was even a good series to begin with. Egoraptor is one of such people.
You have tons of game critics and game design analysts discussing how the original concepts behind Sonic 1, 2 and 3 weren't really even that creative, and all the subsequent games were only worse.
I frankly disagree, but, it's something to think about. Coupled with the juvenile fanbase, that's why Sonic fans hate absolutely everything. They all feel like their entire childhoods have been wasted and fell into some sort of midlife crisis.
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Post by Malcolm Belmont on Feb 7, 2014 3:01:33 GMT -8
News flash: A lot of people don't think Sonic was even a good series to begin with. Egoraptor is one of such people. You have tons of game critics and game design analysts discussing how the original concepts behind Sonic 1, 2 and 3 weren't really even that creative, and all the subsequent games were only worse. I frankly disagree, but, it's something to think about. Coupled with the juvenile fanbase, that's why Sonic fans hate absolutely everything. They all feel like their entire childhoods have been wasted and fell into some sort of midlife crisis. I still like the series even though i am not a rabid fan..hell Sonic Rush is in my Top ten Games of all time and Sonic Heroes is and still will be my childhood...but yeah the Sonic Fanbase does not appeal to be at all. I played Sonic 1,2 and 3 and while they are good i don't think they are that great..i never liked the overelience on speed over platforming..the only time where i felt that worked was in Sonic Generation.. |
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Post by TXA on Feb 7, 2014 3:09:35 GMT -8
...I'm sorry, I still can't quite get behind the excessive bandages. I think they add to the badassery. |
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Post by SteaminFeline56 on Feb 7, 2014 3:11:54 GMT -8
This is probably the comment that wraps up all complaints perfectly: (Warning: Brace Yourself)
WHAT THE FUCK IS THIS. WHAT THE FUCK IS THIS HORSESHIT?!!?! WHO ARE THOSE CHARACTERS?!?! AND WHAT THE FUCK WAS THAT MUSIC!?! THERE WAS NO GUITAR SOLO!! HOW THE SHIT WAS EVERYONE RUNNING AS FAST AS SONIC?! AND WHAT THE TITS HAPPENED TO THEIR VOICES?! DID THEIR BALLS SUDDENLY DROP?!? WHY WAS TAILS SHOOTING LASERS?!?! AND DON'T TRY TO TELL ME THAT AMY ACTUALLY DOES SOMETHING USEFUL IN THIS GAME. AND KNUCKLES. WHAT THE LEGITIMATE FUCK HAPPENED TO KNUCKLES?! HE'S BEEN PROGRESSIVELY GETTING WORSE SINCE SONIC HEROES, BUT NOW HE'S BEEN MURDERED. WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU DOING SEGA?!?! MY ENTIRE CHILDHOOD WAS JUST CHEWED UP AND SHAT OUT.
THIS GAME HASNT BEEN RELEASED YET, SEGA. YOU CAN STILL STOP IT.
Also, I think they are going to make this version of Amy less Sonic obsessed, and more of a badass. Though I don't have anything past Amy landing perfectly when the other 3 landed face first in the game trailer. |
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Post by TXA on Feb 7, 2014 3:15:25 GMT -8
I can't be the only one who finds Amy Rose adorable. Both her current design and this new design(though I agree with Kristian in that the new design is an improvement).
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Post by Malcolm Belmont on Feb 7, 2014 3:22:23 GMT -8
This is probably the comment that wraps up all complaints perfectly: (Warning: Brace Yourself)
WHAT THE FUCK IS THIS. WHAT THE FUCK IS THIS HORSESHIT?!!?! WHO ARE THOSE CHARACTERS?!?! AND WHAT THE FUCK WAS THAT MUSIC!?! THERE WAS NO GUITAR SOLO!! HOW THE SHIT WAS EVERYONE RUNNING AS FAST AS SONIC?! AND WHAT THE TITS HAPPENED TO THEIR VOICES?! DID THEIR BALLS SUDDENLY DROP?!? WHY WAS TAILS SHOOTING LASERS?!?! AND DON'T TRY TO TELL ME THAT AMY ACTUALLY DOES SOMETHING USEFUL IN THIS GAME. AND KNUCKLES. WHAT THE LEGITIMATE FUCK HAPPENED TO KNUCKLES?! HE'S BEEN PROGRESSIVELY GETTING WORSE SINCE SONIC HEROES, BUT NOW HE'S BEEN MURDERED. WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU DOING SEGA?!?! MY ENTIRE CHILDHOOD WAS JUST CHEWED UP AND SHAT OUT.
THIS GAME HASNT BEEN RELEASED YET, SEGA. YOU CAN STILL STOP IT.
Also, I think they are going to make this version of Amy less Sonic obsessed, and more of a badass. Though I don't have anything past Amy landing perfectly when the other 3 landed face first in the game trailer. Sums up the intelligence of the Sonic fanbase.. Also where did you get a comment.. |
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Post by TXA on Feb 7, 2014 3:24:49 GMT -8
I can't believe that fans are behaving this way JUST when my opinion on them was starting to mellow out. I guess I was wrong when I said there's no such thing as a bad community.
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Post by SteaminFeline56 on Feb 7, 2014 4:17:30 GMT -8
This is probably the comment that wraps up all complaints perfectly: (Warning: Brace Yourself)
WHAT THE FUCK IS THIS. WHAT THE FUCK IS THIS HORSESHIT?!!?! WHO ARE THOSE CHARACTERS?!?! AND WHAT THE FUCK WAS THAT MUSIC!?! THERE WAS NO GUITAR SOLO!! HOW THE SHIT WAS EVERYONE RUNNING AS FAST AS SONIC?! AND WHAT THE TITS HAPPENED TO THEIR VOICES?! DID THEIR BALLS SUDDENLY DROP?!? WHY WAS TAILS SHOOTING LASERS?!?! AND DON'T TRY TO TELL ME THAT AMY ACTUALLY DOES SOMETHING USEFUL IN THIS GAME. AND KNUCKLES. WHAT THE LEGITIMATE FUCK HAPPENED TO KNUCKLES?! HE'S BEEN PROGRESSIVELY GETTING WORSE SINCE SONIC HEROES, BUT NOW HE'S BEEN MURDERED. WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU DOING SEGA?!?! MY ENTIRE CHILDHOOD WAS JUST CHEWED UP AND SHAT OUT.
THIS GAME HASNT BEEN RELEASED YET, SEGA. YOU CAN STILL STOP IT.
Also, I think they are going to make this version of Amy less Sonic obsessed, and more of a badass. Though I don't have anything past Amy landing perfectly when the other 3 landed face first in the game trailer. Sums up the intelligence of the Sonic fanbase.. Also where did you get a comment.. Youtube |
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Post by Embodiment of Speed on Feb 7, 2014 5:33:15 GMT -8
News flash: A lot of people don't think Sonic was even a good series to begin with. Egoraptor is one of such people. You have tons of game critics and game design analysts discussing how the original concepts behind Sonic 1, 2 and 3 weren't really even that creative, and all the subsequent games were only worse. I frankly disagree, but, it's something to think about. Coupled with the juvenile fanbase, that's why Sonic fans hate absolutely everything. They all feel like their entire childhoods have been wasted and fell into some sort of midlife crisis. Eeh you're right, a lot of people seem to hate Sonic and wish him to be dead. IGN is one side. Sure, Sonic Lost World wasn't that amazing but did they really had to hand out the review to a sonic hater and downright one of the worst reviewer IGN has? No. Just no. Fortunately, there is still a shimmering light in the fanbase. But people are hating so much on Sonic, it doesn't wonder me that the franchise itself gets hurt. Probably the genesis games aren't creative (I disagree too) but if a game is good, then who cares. Sonic 3 and Knuckles is my third favorite game of all time. Ironically, a lot of fans/haters don't even give good arguments as to why they hate sonic. Directly pointing at Sonic '06 is NOT a good argument. |
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Post by draftsman on Feb 7, 2014 7:38:09 GMT -8
Also keep in mind that Rabbids were what sparked this conversation. I still think Persona 4 is a good game. But i also think their delimas are more realistic.. Anyway i hope we see more footage of this game soon.. Never said it was a bad game per say, but it just doesn't belong in Shin Megami Tensei. It should go with the rest of the generic JRPGs out there. |
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